I'm assuming this topic has been talked about to death but I'm just curious if there is any advantages or disadvantages to either?

IV heard that wet rub is faster and gloss is just for aesthetics, does a gloss finish really slow the board down that much??

Any advice on this would be awesome.

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dannynathan said..
I'm assuming this topic has been talked about to death but I'm just curious if there is any advantages or disadvantages to either?

IV heard that wet rub is faster and gloss is just for aesthetics, does a gloss finish really slow the board down that much??

Any advice on this would be awesome.

For hackers like us you won't notice the difference in speed however a wet rub instead of gloss has two advantages one it will be lighter and cheaper. Some boards look great with a wet rub others look crap.

Wet rub so many shapers have said there faster polish for the look which on many boards looks hot, I have both finishers.

Think the gurus say gloss adds weight - so for performance boards avoid gloss coat to reduce weight . Wooden boards retro boards longboards etc weight is not so important - so gloss coat . Looks better IMO
In saying that I gloss coated 2 boards this weekend with a bit over 700 ml of epoxy per board - so not a lot of weight added
Gloss coat is basically another filler coat - another layer of resin making the board stronger and provides an extra layer of protection against water getting in

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Tassiedevel said..
Think the gurus say gloss adds weight - so for performance boards avoid gloss coat to reduce weight . Wooden boards retro boards longboards etc weight is not so important - so gloss coat . Looks better IMO
In saying that I gloss coated 2 boards this weekend with a bit over 700 ml of epoxy per board - so not a lot of weight added
Gloss coat is basically another filler coat - another layer of resin making the board stronger and provides an extra layer of protection against water getting in

Tim Clarke from up your way is shaping my next board, I actually prefer a matt finish for aesthetics but will be gloss and polish as Tim and other pro Glassers suggest it adds substantially to durability of the boards, especially where the glass isn't as heavy. On a midlength too I like a heavier board as it helps the board maintain natural speed rather than having to pump a light board for speed.

Tim was also talking about moving too epoxy as its less toxic to work with and stronger. Personally though i'm yet to surf an epoxy board that i like the "feel" of and also the flex pattern, i've tried a few because I like the idea behind it but it just hasn't worked for me so far.

I think Gloss is essential on boards with really fine rails too. My FIat Tracker was gloss with really fine rails and I was super rough on that board and it held up amazing... For time constraint reasons I went matt on the Thicklizzy and only have to look at the rails to mark it, really wish i'd gone polish on that... Given that the polish is a finishing coat I wonder if it can be added now to toughen her up?

Yep Andy have read where the Matt finish is supposed to trap air bubbles and improve the flow of the board . I doubt unless somebody was a pro surfer they would notice the difference .
I am only a lightweight so only use 4 oz glass . Use epoxy as the polyester resin gives the wife asthma . Happy wife happy life . Find it very easy to work with , but don't reckon I get the gloss finish as shiny .
Tim makes nice boards .Some of his retro boards look magic .

Andy yes you can have a gloss coat added on a used board.on my trip to Hawaii I met up with some outstanding longboarders who took me under their wings and introduced me to some legends of Hawaii surf. All there boards were wet rubbed when I asked they said believe it or not there a shortage of skilled labour in Hawaii board manufacturing and the company Dust and Fumes don't really glass any of their longboards, so when I returned I had my Waikiki special made without a gloss coat for sentimental reasons.

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Macaha said..
Andy yes you can have a gloss coat added on a used board.on my trip to Hawaii I met up with some outstanding longboarders who took me under their wings and introduced me to some legends of Hawaii surf. All there boards were wet rubbed when I asked they said believe it or not there a shortage of skilled labour in Hawaii board manufacturing and the company Dust and Fumes don't really glass any of their longboards, so when I returned I had my Waikiki special made without a gloss coat for sentimental reasons.

Sounds like a great experience Mac, awesome!!!

Its a common thing from what I can see. I know Tim is about to stop glassing, he will just shape and have someone else glass, Sloppo at Dodges is the same... No one wants to backyard glass as its super toxic, the big companies don't want to glass because of the regulations... I think Tim is going to do shaping trips to Byron and use Rhino to glass...

I might look into it with my board, not a big deal though as I can do my own repairs anyways.

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Macaha said..
Andy yes you can have a gloss coat added on a used board.

Yep I gloss coat all my old board rebuilds . Started after I had Bucko from up near Newcastle do a couple of 70 s board repairs for me - came back glossed look magic . Also the gloss helps covers some of my bodgie patch up jobs .
Funny poly resin is considered toxic while epoxy is considered safe - yet my old neighbour a boat repairer for years reacts violently to epoxy . Luckily for me neither epoxy or poly seem to effect me - yet I can patch a board in the shed using poly and the wife inside the closed house will get asthma from the fumes .
in Nat Young's book he talks about trying different board building materials to avoid inhaling fumes - can't remember what he used now but from memory when he surfed them they fell to bits

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AndyrooMac said..

Macaha said..
Andy yes you can have a gloss coat added on a used board.on my trip to Hawaii I met up with some outstanding longboarders who took me under their wings and introduced me to some legends of Hawaii surf. All there boards were wet rubbed when I asked they said believe it or not there a shortage of skilled labour in Hawaii board manufacturing and the company Dust and Fumes don't really glass any of their longboards, so when I returned I had my Waikiki special made without a gloss coat for sentimental reasons.

Sounds like a great experience Mac, awesome!!!

Its a common thing from what I can see. I know Tim is about to stop glassing, he will just shape and have someone else glass, Sloppo at Dodges is the same... No one wants to backyard glass as its super toxic, the big companies don't want to glass because of the regulations... I think Tim is going to do shaping trips to Byron and use Rhino to glass...

I might look into it with my board, not a big deal though as I can do my own repairs anyways.

If gloss with epoxy Andy it's a bit different to poly - make sure rough up the surface with about 120 grit first to make it bond . They reckon with epoxy to get the clearest finish need to sand within about 4 days before it gets too hard . I am still experimenting with the different epoxy brands but surf flex seems to be the one . Also can purchase it from the Hobart Fibreglass store saving in freight

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Tassiedevel said..

AndyrooMac said..

Macaha said..
Andy yes you can have a gloss coat added on a used board.on my trip to Hawaii I met up with some outstanding longboarders who took me under their wings and introduced me to some legends of Hawaii surf. All there boards were wet rubbed when I asked they said believe it or not there a shortage of skilled labour in Hawaii board manufacturing and the company Dust and Fumes don't really glass any of their longboards, so when I returned I had my Waikiki special made without a gloss coat for sentimental reasons.

Sounds like a great experience Mac, awesome!!!

Its a common thing from what I can see. I know Tim is about to stop glassing, he will just shape and have someone else glass, Sloppo at Dodges is the same... No one wants to backyard glass as its super toxic, the big companies don't want to glass because of the regulations... I think Tim is going to do shaping trips to Byron and use Rhino to glass...

I might look into it with my board, not a big deal though as I can do my own repairs anyways.

If gloss with epoxy Andy it's a bit different to poly - make sure rough up the surface with about 120 grit first to make it bond . They reckon with epoxy to get the clearest finish need to sand within about 4 days before it gets too hard . I am still experimenting with the different epoxy brands but surf flex seems to be the one . Also can purchase it from the Hobart Fibreglass store saving in freight

I'd have to use poly I think... And yeah, Hobart Fibreglass shop is so RAD. I'm on the lookout for beaten up old mals and windsurfers so I can salvage the foam and start playing around with some shaping. I'm going to take the outlines of Lizzy and my new Tim Clark and start playing around

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AndyrooMac said..

Tassiedevel said..
Think the gurus say gloss adds weight - so for performance boards avoid gloss coat to reduce weight . Wooden boards retro boards longboards etc weight is not so important - so gloss coat . Looks better IMO
In saying that I gloss coated 2 boards this weekend with a bit over 700 ml of epoxy per board - so not a lot of weight added
Gloss coat is basically another filler coat - another layer of resin making the board stronger and provides an extra layer of protection against water getting in

Tim Clarke from up your way is shaping my next board, I actually prefer a matt finish for aesthetics but will be gloss and polish as Tim and other pro Glassers suggest it adds substantially to durability of the boards, especially where the glass isn't as heavy. On a midlength too I like a heavier board as it helps the board maintain natural speed rather than having to pump a light board for speed.

Tim was also talking about moving too epoxy as its less toxic to work with and stronger. Personally though i'm yet to surf an epoxy board that i like the "feel" of and also the flex pattern, i've tried a few because I like the idea behind it but it just hasn't worked for me so far.

I think Gloss is essential on boards with really fine rails too. My FIat Tracker was gloss with really fine rails and I was super rough on that board and it held up amazing... For time constraint reasons I went matt on the Thicklizzy and only have to look at the rails to mark it, really wish i'd gone polish on that... Given that the polish is a finishing coat I wonder if it can be added now to toughen her up?

Try basalt cloth with epoxy resin on standard pu blank,its really strong and durable,you want full basalt cloth not standard cloth with basalt strands weaved through it. A mate uses it for his recycled kite boards so might be an option for you.

I've found my gloss boards are markedly stronger as far as normal wear and tear compression damage goes. The gloss also seems to be stronger as far as minor impact with reef or boards goes. It gets stars instead of holes.

All my customs get double 6 decks and 6 bottoms as a starting point. The big boards have triple 6 decks and double 6 bottoms - they are heavy beasts.

But I don't want them snapping when...

That beauty is also 3 7/8' thick.

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thedrip said..
I've found my gloss boards are markedly stronger as far as normal wear and tear compression damage goes. The gloss also seems to be stronger as far as minor impact with reef or boards goes. It gets stars instead of holes.

All my customs get double 6 decks and 6 bottoms as a starting point. The big boards have triple 6 decks and double 6 bottoms - they are heavy beasts.

But I don't want them snapping when...

That beauty is also 3 7/8' thick.

Siiiiick pic dude... fair to say I would not paddle out in that...

Am I right in saying though that Gloss coat does stiffen the board as well, i.e. reduce flex a bit?

Cheers

Wow I didn't think the gloss coat would add any strength at all as it's put on with a brush then buffed to within an inch of its life I've always thought it was for pure aesthetics nice and shiny. Any professional glassers enlighten me !

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Ricardo1709 said..
Wow I didn't think the gloss coat would add any strength at all as it's put on with a brush then buffed to within an inch of its life I've always thought it was for pure aesthetics nice and shiny. Any professional glassers enlighten me !

Same here it may de-flex the board but seriously you would need to be Kelly Slater or Lacey to notice any difference, the only thing it adds a very small amount of weight very little but the bigger the board the more you can notice the weight difference.

Love ya Lacey

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Ricardo1709 said..
Wow I didn't think the gloss coat would add any strength at all as it's put on with a brush then buffed to within an inch of its life I've always thought it was for pure aesthetics nice and shiny. Any professional glassers enlighten me !

I got that, the strengthening, listening to Alex Villalobos, Greg Martz (founder of watermans guild) and Dave Parmetenter talking about board design and glassing... They all mention that they strongly recommend hotcoat and polish to strengthen boards and retain color detail over time.

I certainly noticed this with my Christensen FT, it was a polish and after a year it was still mint... Vs my Lizzy where you only have to look at it and it marks.

surfsplendorpodcast.com/215-greg-martz-of-the-watermans-guild/

Tim Clarke also briefly mentioned the same so i'll chat to him about it tomorrow and get more details on his thoughts

There you go,I always thought the gloss coat was from a car waxing type cream? and buffed. Not from any glass or filler coats ...Helps the boards from impact marks

I dont believe it would have anything to do with flex,I think that would have more/all to do with how the board is glassed,like the drips beast with 3 layers of 6

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chrispy said..
There you go,I always thought the gloss coat was from a car waxing type cream? and buffed. Not from any glass or filler coats ...Helps the boards from impact marks

I dont believe it would have anything to do with flex,I think that would have more/all to do with how the board is glassed,like the drips beast with 3 layers of 6

From my limited knowledge its actually a different type of resin thats is used... But i'm getting pretty confused now... which happens easily

This is pretty helpful though...

www.boardcave.com.au/the-surfers-corner/surfboard-finishes-hot-coat-or-gloss/

Excerpt:

"A Gloss Coat is yet another layer of resin applied to the board after a hotcoat is applied and sanded down. It is another form of resin also with a wax solution added to give you and extra layer of protection and well as an aesthetically pleasing look.

Gloss Coats are usually found on longboards, alternative surfboards, or retro style of boards. It does add weight to a board, so that is why the majority (not all) of shortboards do not get a gloss coat.

That added weight can come in handy for longboards and some of the retro style boards.helping to keep momentum going down the line, etc. and the extra resin gives and added layer of protection against any dings your board my be prone to. It does cost a little extra to add a gloss coat, but if you care about the longevity of your board, it is a small price to pay.

Remember, there are two ways you can ask for your gloss coat. Sanded or polished.
Sanded GlossA sanded gloss coat is exactly what it sounds like. The Gloss is laid, dries, and gets sanded to a high grit. A polish is the same process but when it comes to sanding, it is usually wet sanded and then polished to give you a nice mirror like glossy finish.

Some people claim that a sanded gloss is a little faster than a polished gloss due to the slight texture of the finish holding on to a very small layer of water forming a barrier around the board. That small layer/barrier stays with the board allowing friction-less water against water glide."

Yeah I just messaged my brother in WA who glassed for midget in the 70s and as you say it does add some strength and durability as well as the highly polished look. Well I never would have thought!!!
Loving the midlength thread especially reviews and pics of different boards by the various shapers. So
spoilt for choice

And let's not forget how much resin the glasser squeezes out of the cloth being important for strength.
Look at those white shop boards. Squeegee as much resin out as possible to keep them lighter and have foot dings after the first surf. Even a proper wet rub can be very durable.
Not all glassers and sanders are greater equal. Good glassers and sanders are an unspoken important part of the board building process.

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SP said..
And let's not forget how much resin the glasser squeezes out of the cloth being important for strength.
Look at those white shop boards. Squeegee as much resin out as possible to keep them lighter and have foot dings after the first surf. Even a proper wet rub can be very durable.
Not all glassers and sanders are greater equal. Good glassers and sanders are an unspoken important part of the board building process.

100% SP

I love my Lizzy, its the best board i've ridden... but the glass job from NPJ genuinely lets the board down. I'm seriously looking at having a gloss coat added now, just need to find a local glasser who'll do it for me without having to mortgage the house...

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AndyrooMac said..

thedrip said..
I've found my gloss boards are markedly stronger as far as normal wear and tear compression damage goes. The gloss also seems to be stronger as far as minor impact with reef or boards goes. It gets stars instead of holes.

All my customs get double 6 decks and 6 bottoms as a starting point. The big boards have triple 6 decks and double 6 bottoms - they are heavy beasts.

But I don't want them snapping when...

That beauty is also 3 7/8' thick.

Siiiiick pic dude... fair to say I would not paddle out in that...

Am I right in saying though that Gloss coat does stiffen the board as well, i.e. reduce flex a bit?

Cheers

Thanks. Unfortunately that's not me. I went in early to take pics of a mate on my board. He is 6'5" too.

I'm sure it does add some stiffness. I have two 9'6" guns and the triple stringer one with only a 2 layer deck and single layer bottom is markedly stiffer than the 6/8' thicker board with a 3 layer deck and 2 layer bottom so I think there is a whole bunch of other things that contribute more to stiffness than a gloss coat. But everything being equal -sure.

As far as sanders and glassers go, the two best glass jobs I have got in customs are from the two shapers who do it themselves because they don't like the quality available when they out source it. I see lots of sand throughs and soft glass jobs. Boards cost me too much to be treated as a disposable commodity.

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AndyrooMac said..

SP said..
And let's not forget how much resin the glasser squeezes out of the cloth being important for strength.
Look at those white shop boards. Squeegee as much resin out as possible to keep them lighter and have foot dings after the first surf. Even a proper wet rub can be very durable.
Not all glassers and sanders are greater equal. Good glassers and sanders are an unspoken important part of the board building process.

100% SP

I love my Lizzy, its the best board i've ridden... but the glass job from NPJ genuinely lets the board down. I'm seriously looking at having a gloss coat added now, just need to find a local glasser who'll do it for me without having to mortgage the house...

Why don't you do it yourself tape the rails halfway down 1ltr gloss to 12mm catalyst soft brush fine wet dry then polish some just do the deck or flip over and repeat you can't go too far wrong with gloss coat. I think sanding the filler coat is where you can really screw up a board

Most Single fin longboards will (or should) get a filler coat, sand, then gloss coat then sand to either a wet rub or polish yep it'll add a touch of weight that you wouldn't want in your hp but a log all the weight helps .. but if you could notice a difference in its performance id be surprised ,, save the $$ and put it towards a good fin

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Oceanside Dru said..
Most Single fin longboards will (or should) get a filler coat, sand, then gloss coat then sand to either a wet rub or polish yep it'll add a touch of weight that you wouldn't want in your hp but a log all the weight helps .. but if you could notice a difference in its performance id be surprised ,, save the $$ and put it towards a good fin

Sweet you are in here Dru - your boards are bloody beautiful.. Don't be afraid to pimp Oceanside out on here. I'm sure the lads would love it...

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leashless said..

Oceanside Dru said..
Most Single fin longboards will (or should) get a filler coat, sand, then gloss coat then sand to either a wet rub or polish yep it'll add a touch of weight that you wouldn't want in your hp but a log all the weight helps .. but if you could notice a difference in its performance id be surprised ,, save the $$ and put it towards a good fin

Sweet you are in here Dru - your boards are bloody beautiful.. Don't be afraid to pimp Oceanside out on here. I'm sure the lads would love it...

Yes please I'm just one of your insta followers

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leashless said..

Oceanside Dru said..
Most Single fin longboards will (or should) get a filler coat, sand, then gloss coat then sand to either a wet rub or polish yep it'll add a touch of weight that you wouldn't want in your hp but a log all the weight helps .. but if you could notice a difference in its performance id be surprised ,, save the $$ and put it towards a good fin

Sweet you are in here Dru - your boards are bloody beautiful.. Don't be afraid to pimp Oceanside out on here. I'm sure the lads would love it...

Thanks for the kind words! promise I won't upset anyone with it! just throw my 2c in here and there

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Macaha said..

leashless said..

Oceanside Dru said..
Most Single fin longboards will (or should) get a filler coat, sand, then gloss coat then sand to either a wet rub or polish yep it'll add a touch of weight that you wouldn't want in your hp but a log all the weight helps .. but if you could notice a difference in its performance id be surprised ,, save the $$ and put it towards a good fin

Sweet you are in here Dru - your boards are bloody beautiful.. Don't be afraid to pimp Oceanside out on here. I'm sure the lads would love it...

Yes please I'm just one of your insta followers

Thankyou!

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Oceanside Dru said..
Most Single fin longboards will (or should) get a filler coat, sand, then gloss coat then sand to either a wet rub or polish yep it'll add a touch of weight that you wouldn't want in your hp but a log all the weight helps .. but if you could notice a difference in its performance id be surprised ,, save the $$ and put it towards a good fin

Hey Dru, Love your boards too but haven't seen one in the flesh, are there any Tas that you know of? I'd be super keen to scope one out...
I think you have a sweet looking Hull Middy and real nice pintail I was admiring on insta if I re-call...

Do you agree with the discussion above about the gloss coat also adding durability to the board? I prefer the look of the matt but I like the extra weight and strength if these are benefits of gloss, i'm way too ****e to notice any performance benefits