I was doing it just before the wave started to give me a bit of speed, seems a bit early, but if I stay planted laterally as the wave picks me up there is no fore-aft trim so it is asking for trouble.

hmmmmm what is the correct way.....?

I googled and all the videos about how to catch waves don't address this bit.

Hi Mark
From my (limited) experience there is no one correct way, but on reflection the shorter the board the earlier you tend to get in to a surf stance. On a borrowed 7'5" the only way I could paddle in the chop was in a narrow kind of surf stance and was definitely in a surf stance before take off. When on my 9'8" I move around a lot more to maintain trim regardless of stance. In slower building waves on the bigger boards I reckon l am standing laterally as I take off and then usually shuffling back and into a surf stance as I start to turn.

On slack waves I tend to paddle in with feet horizontal then change once I catch. Steeper waves means surf stance to paddle in. I change it about...do the same two scenarios no matter the board. Whatever works really.

I am very seldom in a side by side stance in the surf zone; there is just no fore aft balance adjustment as you get hit by swells, current, boils, etc. While paddling or standing around in the surf zone, my feet are usually a few inches on each side of the stringer, and the toes of one foot are roughly across from the heel of the other. This is especially true on smaller boards, where the feet might already be closer to a surf stance. I am in a semi surf stance when paddling into position to catch a wave (meaning that both feet have moved closer to the center line and slightly more spread fore and aft), and then I go into a full surf stance with both feet along the stringer for those last few hard strokes when I need to be able to shift weight fore and aft quickly. Since I may be quite far forward at that point to get the board to drop in, I would then hop back and reach my rear foot for the stomp pad as the board drops in.
Interesting observation. A well-meaning friend of ours who surfs a 9' board has been trying to tell my wife that she needs to paddle and catch waves in a side by side stance (despite the fact that she is a much better surfer). The other day he tried our 7'11" board, and his side by side stance did not allow him to maintain any balance much less catch any waves. He now understands why we do not paddle our surf sups in a side by side stance.

If you go to "paddlewoo.com", there are a few really good articles on this, complete with photos.

As soon as i feel the wave is propelling me forward, i switch. Earlier for steeper, later for weaker, or not at all for really p1ssweak.

Everyone has a favorite stance as they paddle into a wave, one that suits them.

This vid shows exactly when I make the switch.
I made it up to answer a question about turning an 8'10 Speeed a few weeks ago, but you might find it useful.

Thanks this is all helpful.
I think part of my problem is treating waves at the same spot as all the same and I think I need to consider the steepness of the takeoff a bit more.

First, you should NEVER paddle feet parallel for taking off. As you saw, you have no fore/aft control, that's the biggest mistake people make.

With one feet forward and one back, you can take off in one strike, and do the actula take off by moving your weigth around. Yesterday, some SUP cheered for me while I was taking off on a nice set, but let off a disappointed sigh as I stopped paddling after the second stroke, he thought I missed the wave... but I was just taking off with my body weight rather than brute paddle motoring. You enter the waves much earlier than with parallel feet, and with more initial speed, a strong foundation for the rest of the ride.

Plus the take offs are much more fun this way, you get the kind of "pop" on take off as with prone surfing.

This said, I still switch stance once the take off is well on its way: but I switch from a fencing position to the surfing one: I found that taking off in the surfing position is not efficient, ass you have less balance, and less power to apply on the paddle. Most Pro SUP wave riders take off in surfing stance... but they are pro. I cringe every time I see a "normal" SUPer trying to take off in surfing stance... or with parallel feet.

As supthecreek and Mark said, there are different "fencing" stance for different people and different waves: for steep late take offs, you want your back foot way aft, but your weight still on the front foot

Nice footwork STC.
When I first started out, I stood with my front foot pretty much at the handle and my back foot slightly behind. More for balance than anything.
As time goes by I find myself further and further back, with a more pronounced gap between front and back foot. Easier to turn for a wave. Less transition and more ready for the drop.

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supthecreek said..

This vid shows exactly when I make the switch.
I made it up to answer a question about turning an 8'10 Speeed a few weeks ago, but you might find it useful.

You make it look so easy

One day I'll manage it.

One thing I noticed from the vid is that supthecreek paddles to his back a lot. I am natural foot also, so facing starboard and try to finish my "pre-wave" paddling on that side. (My board needs a ****load of hard paddling for 10sec before the wave)..... so I paddle hard on the port side(feet laterally), board starts to turn of course and try to time it that I have to paddle say 2-3 strokes on the starboard about the time the wave gets to me and I am also going surf stance at same time.
Then if i need a couple of paddles as the wave picks me up it is easy to paddle to my front (starboard)

He is doing the opposite, paddling to his back side....


Next my board is 10x33.5 all rounder, would foot placement be the same (just behind handle, and over sidies), but rear foot movement is more pronounced?


Ta

Mark.... I paddle to my backside because that puts the paddle on the same side as my forward foot.
I often move my left foot forward on the board, but even when I don't, I lean forward on my left foot.
Why this matters to me.....
I stack my hands MUCH more efficiently, while paddling on the same side as my front foot.

When I paddle right sided, I "row" more, because it is harder to stack my hands over the right side of the board.
The weak angle of the paddle shaft translates to much less power







I paddle on my left side when surfing rights as well.... makes for some interesting paddle switches on late takeoffs

I try to never switch sides as I paddle for a wave, I simply "time" my turn to put my board on the desired angle, at takeoff

i am regular footed, but often switch to goofy when paddling in to lefts---i was switching back to reg foot as i made the drop, but have now just been leaving it goofy---why not? now im switching when catching rights, just to try my goofy back hand---i still ride much better reg footed, but find that being able to switch can help a lot when paddling in and making drops

freaks out the proners when they see me switch a few times on a given wave

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supthecreek said..
Everyone has a favorite stance as they paddle into a wave, one that suits them.

This vid shows exactly when I make the switch.
I made it up to answer a question about turning an 8'10 Speeed a few weeks ago, but you might find it useful.

Downright Tropical there, supthecreek!

For what its worth, I am much stronger on my right side, and I am much better able to get the paddle vertical (when necessary) and to do a J-stroke (when necessary) on my right. I am natural foot and mostly ride right-handers. So I start at about 45 degrees to the wave, feet perpendicular to the board, watching the wave out my right eye (easier when paddling on the right IMO), and thus deciding how much I need the board to turn so I am at the correct angle at take-off. In that way I am at full power, timing everything as best I can to catch the wave.

I will then switch stance before the wave gets to me according to the board size, the wave size, and the steepness of the wave. I will switch earliest if the wave is big and/or steep and if I am on a shorter board (e.g. 7'10" Minion). For a smaller, fatter wave on a bigger board, I might even wait until I feel the surge that I have caught the wave before switching stance.

Again, for what it is worth, this technique (taught to me by Phil Trigger) also helps if the wave is a bit fat. The timing is improved. And if I need to paddle hard, again I don't want switch sides, but I tend to get forward and bend my knees to really dig (Colas taught me that).

And for what it is worth, if I think I am a bit too far out for the wave, I will turn to the right (facing out toward the wave) and paddle on my left side, with the paddle on an angle so that I turn 120 degrees (e.g. from 12:00 past 6:00 to to 7:30) so that I am 45 degrees to the wave as described above, then switch to the right. In that way I am closer to the break, closer to the shore, and I have balanced the use of my left and right side.

Mark (and others)
this is one of the most important steps to sup wave riding. can take a while to get right, and every board is diffrerent.
Biggest thing i found when learnign and also seeing others learn now is the feel you need to paddle so much to get onto a wave. you shouldnt.
You need to learn to swing into a wave, and do it with not many strokes.
things to learn - when on flat water or waiting for sets, practice paddling in circles. do it on both sides, see how least amount of strokes to get board around. try weighting rear foot to get her round more. try changing front foot somewhat toward middle of board more into surf stance. then try putting ur back foot back a foot to get that board round quick. this not only teaches you how to get the board round but is also great for balance.
in reality id say 2-5 strokes max to get board around and only if you are either too far out or a fat wave should you need more to get onto a wave and going.

points to consider when paddling:
what feels comfy for paddling around. for me, front foot paralel with stringer bout 2/3 between stringer and rail, heel just in front of handle, rear foot about 45 degrees, toes just behind handle. when paddling onto wave i either stick with this or start to move my front foot further toward stringer and depending on fatness of wave sometimes further forward, sometimes if i need to get round quick or take steeper drop rear foot back a bit and getting closer to stringer. only small increments of movement while paddling getting board around. then when onto wave (not too early, common mistate) front foot back to back foot and back foot back, how far depends on wave and how extreme you wanna ride. you wanna turn hard n smack lips get back, you wanna cruise or make a section forward a foot. bigger boards will need rear foot to move about rail to rail and forward and back.
after paddling like this on short boards even if i jump on a big tug boat i cant go back to paralel stance, it just feels awkward to the body.
bend knees, bend upper body from the hips. paddling should come from the legs. hamstrings, glutes, quads. learn to engage them, not just standing tall and using upper body. you will tire and or tear urself and look like a goonie. lower yourself and get ur COG down.
paddle vert. work on it. its harder with wider boards, but reach. millions of vids on the net.
short strokes, reach forward, never go past toes. short strokes, save ur rails and ur body and energy.
i woudlnt say im a brilliant paddler, but i find writing this out helps me remember things i think about when i am paddling, and have done so via reading and watching others. hopefully this helps.

so supthecreek showed some good skills of backside paddlign, yep awesoem man but i would say for learnign to get onto waves, prob best to work on going in paddlign on ur toe side. you will feel more comfortable and stable going around that way. i still feel goonie going round on my heel side after 3 years. but hey try it, like i said practice paddling in circles both sides. i recon it is the most crucial to learn.

enjoy. hope it helps.
big props to Eric from Paddlewoo - some great info on his blog. hopefully he doesnt fade out and keeps up the good work.

Yep, Paddlewoo has most of these technique things fully sorted. And agree, hope Eric doesn't lose the stoke - legend.

For me its surf stance all the way. I paddle around the break in a kung fu stance, so not fully surf stance. In fact i find parallel stance way less stable now - never used to be like this.

If I'm going out and see a wave I'd like to ride I'll go into near full surf stance - regular foot so right foot back - and either pivot left (easy) or right (getting better, paddling heel side is a nightmare, some like Creek seem to have mastered it though) depending on where the curl is. Then quite often, once I'm roughly perpendicular to the wave and the wave is start to lift me, I might need to throw in a correcting "J" stroke or two to get the board pointed exactly right (or correct an over swing) and then start with a gentle straight stroke to get going without pulling pulling myself off the board and then into the short, straight, stabby, to the toes but not further back strokes that Caution mentions. Important to go like a mad thing on these short sharp strokes on flatter waves.

What I find really important is to hold that surf stance as long as you can (with the feet close as possible to the stringer - doesn't seem possible to have feet directly over the centreline however without balance issues) and in fact i find it really helps if i'm conciously trying to touch the deck of the board with my right knee (remembering I'm right foot back, almost on the kick pad, still in surf stance). Never actually get the knee touching the deck of course cos i'm too old and stiff but just the action of trying to do it keeps my CoG low, and me balanced. I have a tendency to start standing up slightly when I can feel the board picking up speed. Nothing kills the catching of the wave more then starting to stand up. The knee trick is a good counter. Once you're fully into the wave then you can start to stand up (a little) as part of a flex or pump for speed or setting the trim line process, depending on what is unfolding in front of you.

Paddle cut to head height helps keep me low and paddling effectively when low, and a small blade reduces the sensitivity of small SUPs to overly powerful strokes, and save the old fellas shoulders to boot.

My 2c.

Forgot to mention that, and living in Wellington Un Zud its a daily reality, surf stance is great for managing a strong offshore, gets you down and out of the wind better.

Feet next to the stringer seems extremely difficult on a 32" board. I find it easier to have feet each side of the stringer

www.supgower.com/2010/11/short-sup-technique/

Trying to post a vid here but failing miserably

Yes agree, would be tricky on a wider board but I'm on a 28 wide 7'2 and putting foot anywhere near the rail at the front usually results in a rail dig and boom the waves gone.

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CAUTION said..
Mark (and others)
this is one of the most important steps to sup wave riding. can take a while to get right, and every board is diffrerent.
Biggest thing i found when learnign and also seeing others learn now is the feel you need to paddle so much to get onto a wave. you shouldnt.
You need to learn to swing into a wave, and do it with not many strokes.

I am listening and absorbing all you post it is good advice thanks ...... but are u sure this bit above is the case on my big board? My 10x33.5 is WAY harder to paddle than an old old 9x30 I have. I think the width means the nose rocker pushes a lot of water. For waist high waves I have to paddle 101% for about.... hmm.... 10-15 strokes before the wave gets to me.

Would be nice if I could use the 9x30 lol ...

I am usually in surf stance before or at least as I am paddling for the wave.



It is a good idea to practice paddling around in surf stance on flat water or out the back just to get used to it even switch stance etc.

10 or 15 strokes is a lot to catch a wave, maybe for bigger waves at passage or somewhere but for punchy beach break waves 2 or 3 strokes is often all that is needed if you are close enough to the peak.

my first board was wider and i thought the same, this thing takes forever to get around.
AND it did compared to my shortboard now, BUT you gotta leanr how to use your feet, body weight and stroke to get you round.
all practice.
if it is not coming round fast, ie your case try surf stance and getting the rear foot back and i garantee it will come round quick, but you will prob keep falling off. work on balance, practice paddling in circles, getting it round quick, playing with balance etc. and then it will come.
then you will prob put the big board in the shed and go a smaller board. that being said going down to 9x30 is a big step.

Zuesman nice vid, you got the wave, BUT shows you paddled in too early, then had to correct three times via changing hands and sides and nearly lost rail a few times. could have just swung in late n straight in. That being said its surfing, and no rules apply. you get the wave, you win. ride on.

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CAUTION said..

Zuesman nice vid, you got the wave, BUT shows you paddled in too early, then had to correct three times via changing hands and sides and nearly lost rail a few times. could have just swung in late n straight in. That being said its surfing, and no rules apply. you get the wave, you win. ride on.

Oh dear.
I was going to comment on how much that vid reflected my standard approach, but now that I know I'm doing it wrong, I'll just shutup.
Sigh, back to the drawing board........

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Brenno said...

CAUTION said..

Zuesman nice vid, you got the wave, BUT shows you paddled in too early, then had to correct three times via changing hands and sides and nearly lost rail a few times. could have just swung in late n straight in. That being said its surfing, and no rules apply. you get the wave, you win. ride on.

Oh dear.
I was going to comment on how much that vid reflected my standard approach, but now that I know I'm doing it wrong, I'll just shutup.
Sigh, back to the drawing board........

Ha! Whatever Caution...

Paddling in too early?? It's a SUP... And I caught the wave... Also out of shot was a pack of short boarders sitting close together. Better for me to sit further out than get tangled in that.
Changed paddle sides twice. Board was an 8'8" not 10 footer.

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supthecreek said...
Everyone has a favorite stance as they paddle into a wave, one that suits them.

This vid shows exactly when I make the switch.
I made it up to answer a question about turning an 8'10 Speeed a few weeks ago, but you might find it useful.

After watching your vid I had a look at an old vid of mine and never realised how much the feet move. I guess it's just like riding a bike.

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Greenroom said...

supthecreek said...
Everyone has a favorite stance as they paddle into a wave, one that suits them.

This vid shows exactly when I make the switch.
I made it up to answer a question about turning an 8'10 Speeed a few weeks ago, but you might find it useful.

After watching your vid I had a look at an old vid of mine and never realised how much the feet move. I guess it's just like riding a bike.

Oh no! Someone else doing their own thing!
Prepare to be scolded. Especially for the "sitdownlegsintheair" manouver! Tsk tsk!
Haha, Love it.

Greenroom.... good stuff, fun vid!