Hi I'm a first time poster here . I'm after a yacht to cruise from Perth to Langkawi , on offer is a aluminum van de stadt 34 and a duncanson 35 . Both yachts require work but they are in my price range. what my question is which would make the better cruising yacht ? I plan to live on board 6 months a year and sail most of the time single handed .

The one that needs the least work and maintenance,

gary

pretty similar yachts reputation wise. My preference would be the fibreglass yacht as fibreglass is really easy to repair, where for me aluminum is an unknown quantity.

Would also enquire on each yacht's windward capabilities. Its easy to go from Perth to asia, a lot harder to return with constant headwinds. Jimmy Cornell's "World Cruising Routes" stated that this route "...may only be accomplished by a yacht that has excellent windward sailing abilities"

Ilenart

Aluminum can be quite noisy with wave action at night, so depends on the insulation

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monobrow said..
Hi I'm a first time poster here . I'm after a yacht to cruise from Perth to Langkawi , on offer is a aluminum van de stadt 34 and a duncanson 35 . Both yachts require work but they are in my price range. what my question is which would make the better cruising yacht ? I plan to live on board 6 months a year and sail most of the time single handed .

Depends a lot on how well built the alloy Van de Stadt is. If the hull is painted or bare alloy. If the alloy boat has the deep keel I think it would probably sail better. Mate has an alloy Cole 42 that is exceptionally well built and is quiet at sea and surprisingly cool below. He is also superb at alloy welding. More things to worry about with alloy, right antifoul, skin fittings, lead sinkers in the bilge etc. Most of the time the worries are unfounded.

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monobrow said..
Hi I'm a first time poster here . I'm after a yacht to cruise from Perth to Langkawi , on offer is a aluminum van de stadt 34 and a duncanson 35 . Both yachts require work but they are in my price range. what my question is which would make the better cruising yacht ? I plan to live on board 6 months a year and sail most of the time single handed .

When you get to Langkawi, have a couple schooners of Tiger for me at the RLYC should be about 5 Ringgits. Cheers

Hi Monobrow,
Welcome to the forum! A bit of a lateral viewpoint: If it sinks and you want to salvage it, toss the alloy boat, it's now toast
Fibreglass you can recover, alloy you won't.
You may prefer that of course, some do!
Cheers,
SB

Would also enquire on each yacht's windward capabilities. Its easy to go from Perth to asia, a lot harder to return with constant headwinds. Jimmy Cornell's "World Cruising Routes" stated that this route "...may only be accomplished by a yacht that has excellent windward sailing abilities"


Wind on the nose is one thing.
The other is NO WIND.
In 3 years cruising that area in a large variety of boats, that was the most frustrating weather I encountered.
A big fuel tank and lots of filters for the dirty fuel that you buy in SE Asia is a major consideration.

Gary

On a slightly different note:- Why would one take a yacht from Aus to Langkawi?? A bit like taking tea to China.

The alloy VDS. Is it the one a forum member had that caught fire some time ago??

And getting Australian Registration can be a pain if you do not know the yachts history

Looking at the photos of the Van De Stadt's interior - lots of wood paneling.

With an Aluminium hull and deck, how is the wood cabinetry tied to the aluminium - is it epoxied or is every cabinet screwed/bolted to the alu stringers on all four it's corners ?

That has to be the one that had a fire and was written off by the insurance company.

An insurance company wrote off my son's genuine $4500 value car over less than $300 in parts and same in labour.

The VDS 34 is a great yacht and there is nothing wrong with alloy yachts. If I was looking for a safe, fast and comfortable deep sea yacht, that one would be on my short list. She looks to be floating well on her lines.

That one I am sure has traceable history and should be Aus Reg'able. That might cost more than a few shekels though.

More than 30 for less than 30 is hard to resist.

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shaggybaxter said..
If it sinks and you want to salvage it, toss the alloy boat, it's now toast. Fibreglass you can recover, alloy you won't.

I beg to differ on that shaggy. "Lady Katherine" nee "ENVY II" was allowed to sink at Manly Marina when Cap'n Ben was driving her. He or the insurance company refloated her pretty quick and he continued to campaign the Gladdy race for a few years after in charter survey.

Last I heard she was for sale in T'ville for not about $35k. I believe a youngish Master V guy working the Whitsundays bought her.

That boat is Jezebel, the one that pumpnjump owned when it caught fire back in 2014, it's even still the same paint job now as it was then.
He bought a Benny First 41s5 in Adelaide to replace the VDS which had been written off by Nautilus Insurance.

What's the go with aluminium hulls and electrolysis one hears all kinds of stories of the effects especially in marinas. If I remember correctly
Lou Abraham's Challenge 11 was aluminium and a crew member told me after one race ,mind you that was at the bar and one or twenty beers later, that they hung zinc anodes over the side when tied up. Old wives tale?

I am no shipwright BB, and I defer to those here far more versed than I, but to this numpty, salt water and alloy are fine if their is an anode you can attack instead. I've only known two alloy boats that have foundered, both were written off straight away by insurance even when one was underwater for only a couple of days.
I'd guess that electrolysis can't surely work that quickly (every stink boat I know would have sunk if so) , I assume it is more the inability to effectively ensure no salt water is hidden in nasty little corners weaving its magic with the anode on the other side of the alloy doing sweet fa.
Anybody?

An unkind name for aluminium boats is "Alka Selzer's". Aluminium is low down on the galvanic scale meaning, essentially, it becomes next in line to protect your other metal bits once your zincs have been eaten up.

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Bananabender said..
What's the go with aluminium hulls and electrolysis one hears all kinds of stories of the effects especially in marinas. If I remember correctly
Lou Abraham's Challenge 11 was aluminium and a crew member told me after one race ,mind you that was at the bar and one or twenty beers later, that they hung zinc anodes over the side when tied up. Old wives tale?

There are lots of stories! I had a Star alloy fishing vessel in the 80's that I had built when I left the navy. I wish I had left it bare alloy. Had to chase up the right antifoul and use the right skin fittings but there was never any problem with electrolysis until one of the other fishing vessels tied up alongside with copper in his antifouling. Ended up with "Two Bob" marks along the waterline. Mates alloy Cole 42 was built about 1980 and he found washers and all sorts of crap in the bilges but no signs of electrolysis. The Cole is now in bare aluminium. He did remove some excess anodes though. I have seen a 45 foot cruiser have two sheets welded into the bow at the anchor well where the anchor had been resting.
If I had an aluminium yacht I would take it back to bare aluminium like Pen-Duik-5

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LooseChange said..
That boat is Jezebel, the one that pumpnjump owned when it caught fire back in 2014, it's even still the same paint job now as it was then.
He bought a Benny First 41s5 in Adelaide to replace the VDS which had been written off by Nautilus Insurance.

So, how bad/extensive was the fire???

What's it worth????

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Ramona said..

Bananabender said..
What's the go with aluminium hulls and electrolysis one hears all kinds of stories of the effects especially in marinas. If I remember correctly
Lou Abraham's Challenge 11 was aluminium and a crew member told me after one race ,mind you that was at the bar and one or twenty beers later, that they hung zinc anodes over the side when tied up. Old wives tale?

There are lots of stories! I had a Star alloy fishing vessel in the 80's that I had built when I left the navy. I wish I had left it bare alloy. Had to chase up the right antifoul and use the right skin fittings but there was never any problem with electrolysis until one of the other fishing vessels tied up alongside with copper in his antifouling. Ended up with "Two Bob" marks along the waterline. Mates alloy Cole 42 was built about 1980 and he found washers and all sorts of crap in the bilges but no signs of electrolysis. The Cole is now in bare aluminium. He did remove some excess anodes though. I have seen a 45 foot cruiser have two sheets welded into the bow at the anchor well where the anchor had been resting.
If I had an aluminium yacht I would take it back to bare aluminium like Pen-Duik-5

I like that spartan look too, Ramona.

Mmm, another one for the list!? How much to truck it to Queensland ?? Any idea??

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theselkie said..

Ramona said..

Bananabender said..
What's the go with aluminium hulls and electrolysis one hears all kinds of stories of the effects especially in marinas. If I remember correctly
Lou Abraham's Challenge 11 was aluminium and a crew member told me after one race ,mind you that was at the bar and one or twenty beers later, that they hung zinc anodes over the side when tied up. Old wives tale?

There are lots of stories! I had a Star alloy fishing vessel in the 80's that I had built when I left the navy. I wish I had left it bare alloy. Had to chase up the right antifoul and use the right skin fittings but there was never any problem with electrolysis until one of the other fishing vessels tied up alongside with copper in his antifouling. Ended up with "Two Bob" marks along the waterline. Mates alloy Cole 42 was built about 1980 and he found washers and all sorts of crap in the bilges but no signs of electrolysis. The Cole is now in bare aluminium. He did remove some excess anodes though. I have seen a 45 foot cruiser have two sheets welded into the bow at the anchor well where the anchor had been resting.
If I had an aluminium yacht I would take it back to bare aluminium like Pen-Duik-5

I like that spartan look too, Ramona.

Mmm, another one for the list!? How much to truck it to Queensland ?? Any idea??

I recently received a quote from Brisbane to Perth of $22k for a 38ft yacht

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Ilenart said..

theselkie said..

Ramona said..

Bananabender said..
What's the go with aluminium hulls and electrolysis one hears all kinds of stories of the effects especially in marinas. If I remember correctly
Lou Abraham's Challenge 11 was aluminium and a crew member told me after one race ,mind you that was at the bar and one or twenty beers later, that they hung zinc anodes over the side when tied up. Old wives tale?

There are lots of stories! I had a Star alloy fishing vessel in the 80's that I had built when I left the navy. I wish I had left it bare alloy. Had to chase up the right antifoul and use the right skin fittings but there was never any problem with electrolysis until one of the other fishing vessels tied up alongside with copper in his antifouling. Ended up with "Two Bob" marks along the waterline. Mates alloy Cole 42 was built about 1980 and he found washers and all sorts of crap in the bilges but no signs of electrolysis. The Cole is now in bare aluminium. He did remove some excess anodes though. I have seen a 45 foot cruiser have two sheets welded into the bow at the anchor well where the anchor had been resting.
If I had an aluminium yacht I would take it back to bare aluminium like Pen-Duik-5

I like that spartan look too, Ramona.

Mmm, another one for the list!? How much to truck it to Queensland ?? Any idea??

I recently received a quote from Brisbane to Perth of $22k for a 38ft yacht

OMG!

Keerist, that makes a difference.
Considering it cost me $50K to ship a boat 16,000kms and that was a combo road and sea, asking $22K for a 4000km trip with no borders/customs seems a bit tough.
Ouch.

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theselkie said..

LooseChange said..
That boat is Jezebel, the one that pumpnjump owned when it caught fire back in 2014, it's even still the same paint job now as it was then.
He bought a Benny First 41s5 in Adelaide to replace the VDS which had been written off by Nautilus Insurance.

So, how bad/extensive was the fire???
Obviously not that bad if it still has the same paint job now as back then which begs the question as to why Nautilus wrote it off.

What's it worth????
I guess whatever someone is prepared to pay for it in its current condition. As it states in the for sale blurb "In good working order, with some cosmetic damage from previous owner"

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Ilenart said..

theselkie said..

Ramona said..

Bananabender said..
What's the go with aluminium hulls and electrolysis one hears all kinds of stories of the effects especially in marinas. If I remember correctly
Lou Abraham's Challenge 11 was aluminium and a crew member told me after one race ,mind you that was at the bar and one or twenty beers later, that they hung zinc anodes over the side when tied up. Old wives tale?

There are lots of stories! I had a Star alloy fishing vessel in the 80's that I had built when I left the navy. I wish I had left it bare alloy. Had to chase up the right antifoul and use the right skin fittings but there was never any problem with electrolysis until one of the other fishing vessels tied up alongside with copper in his antifouling. Ended up with "Two Bob" marks along the waterline. Mates alloy Cole 42 was built about 1980 and he found washers and all sorts of crap in the bilges but no signs of electrolysis. The Cole is now in bare aluminium. He did remove some excess anodes though. I have seen a 45 foot cruiser have two sheets welded into the bow at the anchor well where the anchor had been resting.
If I had an aluminium yacht I would take it back to bare aluminium like Pen-Duik-5

I like that spartan look too, Ramona.

Mmm, another one for the list!? How much to truck it to Queensland ?? Any idea??

I recently received a quote from Brisbane to Perth of $22k for a 38ft yacht

Perth to Brisbane is a lot cheaper. Back loads for empty trucks. However, if it is over 3.5m wide, there are escorts involved, and that is expensive. (And those escorts do not wear short skirts.)

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Yara said..

Ilenart said..

theselkie said..

Ramona said..

Bananabender said..
What's the go with aluminium hulls and electrolysis one hears all kinds of stories of the effects especially in marinas. If I remember correctly
Lou Abraham's Challenge 11 was aluminium and a crew member told me after one race ,mind you that was at the bar and one or twenty beers later, that they hung zinc anodes over the side when tied up. Old wives tale?

There are lots of stories! I had a Star alloy fishing vessel in the 80's that I had built when I left the navy. I wish I had left it bare alloy. Had to chase up the right antifoul and use the right skin fittings but there was never any problem with electrolysis until one of the other fishing vessels tied up alongside with copper in his antifouling. Ended up with "Two Bob" marks along the waterline. Mates alloy Cole 42 was built about 1980 and he found washers and all sorts of crap in the bilges but no signs of electrolysis. The Cole is now in bare aluminium. He did remove some excess anodes though. I have seen a 45 foot cruiser have two sheets welded into the bow at the anchor well where the anchor had been resting.
If I had an aluminium yacht I would take it back to bare aluminium like Pen-Duik-5

I like that spartan look too, Ramona.

Mmm, another one for the list!? How much to truck it to Queensland ?? Any idea??

I recently received a quote from Brisbane to Perth of $22k for a 38ft yacht

Perth to Brisbane is a lot cheaper. Back loads for empty trucks. However, if it is over 3.5m wide, there are escorts involved, and that is expensive. (And those escorts do not wear short skirts.)

Also oversized can not go as a road train

It's 3.3m beam. Mmm, curiouser and curiouser.

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Ilenart said..

I recently received a quote from Brisbane to Perth of $22k for a 38ft yacht

I would crew that route with you for no charge, just for the experience. I have all of December and January free.

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Wollemi said..

Ilenart said..

I recently received a quote from Brisbane to Perth of $22k for a 38ft yacht

I would crew that route with you for no charge, just for the experience. I have all of December and January free.

we didn't go ahead with the purchase, too many issues

Issues?? They are things sent from God to see how good you are.

Kids are a lot worse I can tell you.

With that VDS 34 I seriously doubt that the aluminium hull integrity was one of the issues.

If you bought it for $20k, spent $10k on it in short order, you should have a world cruiser ready to go on whatever your on going cruising budget is.

If the cruising budget is an issue, you may need to rethink your plan.

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Wollemi said..

Ilenart said..

I recently received a quote from Brisbane to Perth of $22k for a 38ft yacht

I would crew that route with you for no charge, just for the experience. I have all of December and January free.

Don't think I'm up to the task of skippering that route. Would be looking at enlisting someone.

Ramona, fancy doing a delivery skipper job (paid of course! ) ??