Thanks all for the input on getting this built.
I finally got her together and made it out to try out this newfangled machine.

As built at our campsite with a 80's windsurf sail cut down just a bit on the leech to suit:



I ran right out of time so the boom really is cobbled together and is just zip tied to a collar of PVC slid over mast.
The seat bottom is just lashed right around the frame as I did not get the bails fit.
A full batten modern sail I did a rush job of cutting at last moment was a total loss as I took the heart out of it...
I never even pinned in the stub axles and relied on suction on a tight fit to hold them in the receivers..

NONE of it seemed to matter- this gal was a perfect hoot- what fun.
Odd bit- I have been sailing forever and for some reason was not really sure of my footing on what kind of creature I was creating.
That is one of the reasons I did not design from scratch and used a proven design for a first built.
Funny bit- first time I took the helm it all came together..: "ah- this damn things a boat- pull in the sheet and away we go."

I ran down the length of the island the first time out and had a absolute time of it- rolling along on a perfect lark.
A partial video of that ride:



At the end of the run and the dunes behind I had to get her across to get out of there:





I got over to the coastal road for pickup and tossed her on the car when I got rescued:







After I got my feet under me I was able to really run the yacht over a bunch of conditions and got a good feel for how things were sorted.
This is a fast run where I was really rolling along- wind is well back off the starboard quarter:



A couple of things I tried on this build really worked well:

One- the lip seals over the hub bearings were perfect- I ran through waves with sand/seawater slurry everywhere plus dragging the cart through soft sand and sitting for long periods with wind blown fine sand.
When I pulled the wheels after three weeks there was not a single grain of sand on the bearings or any water.

Two- the spar I used was a two piece 75% carbon.
I did a external layup of two layers of 12k 100% carbon biax sleeve set in epoxy at the foot for reinforcement- first layer up two feet with second run up four feet.
I ran the reinforcement in this manner for increased crush strength to resist buckling as the spar left the socket which was 12" in length.
This worked very well- was a lightweight way to strengthen the spar and she stood up to the considerable abuse I handed out as I was testing out the cart.
I did spray enamel the mast white and was able to leave it out in baking sun with no trouble as she kept cool and at no risk of UV.
I had brought a spare one piece unaltered spar as a fall back and the plan was to baby the carbon mast so as not break it.
By the end I had forgotten all such worries and had no problems.

I found that the sand yachts are capable craft and did not shy from pushing things a bit.
In one instance I short tacked up the beach for three miles against a 22 knot breeze with full sail slamming the cart across the wind to make way as I was working on just a 50' wide berm down by the surf.
A bit of a rough ride bouncing up on two wheels and slamming back as I crossed the wind but she held up...LOL.

So I am ready to set towards putting a new design to paper.

A couple of parameters:

a) LIGHT weight: target <15 kg ( the build above is 24 and I want to be much lighter..)
b) Fast to rig: as above- a couple of minutes but would like less: like unfolding a lawn chair- stand the spar, slip on sail and go..
c) Soft sail: minimum or no battens, dacron, simple sleeve over spar and free to rotate, no set downhaul, boom rigged, etc
d) Foot steer
e) EASY to carry/drag/schlepp over rough terrain.
f) Fully corrosion/wet/sand proof for beach service (steering, spar, bearings etc)

Thanks again all.

Nice job there trbnt

Just curious, i understand most of your design rationale but why the insistence on a soft sail?

Since I have just started playing with cam batten wind surfer racing sails a soft sail seems an unusual performance impediment.

Fantastic Fabrication!

The front forks are somethinge else!!!

Thanks guys.

Good morning John,

Soft sail.... I am approaching this design as from the standpoint of wanting as simple of design as possible with weigh, ease and speed of use as being the highest priorities.

Where I am coming from-

1) I am a hack- my large boat is really fine sailing - a lovely old Rhodes CCA cruiser:




Problem is I work on on boats for a living and the old gal gets no love- in spite of this she sails beautifully.
I remember tacking out of a creek one time- rough 30 year old sails, the remaining battens missing from the main as years back they had shaken out in a squaw and I had never replaced them in spite of grand plans for a proper full batten cruising main....
A friend of mine on shore saw me head out and commented later- "you need to at least put some battens back in the main"...
Well I didn't- I can tack the 40 footer like a dingy under main alone and she moves right along in spite of it all.

2) I am looking to have a really simple to use platform with minimum pack size and complexity- that windsurf sail I am using above bundles in a second to very small size and fits in the seat pocket- the ultimate of simplicity and light weight (I would loose the windows and it would be even better..) Rigging is almost instant- slide it over the mast and snap a clip at tack.

3) The cart didn't seem to need a bunch of more complex sail shape control- plenty of body in that sail I used and for yet very nice speed- in short it worked.

Could things be improved in both my sailboat and the cart with more complexity- of course but I am shooting from the get go here for user ease and I believe there is a sweet spot where function is very good while the gear is still very simple.


I had set out to rig this WITH a modern heavy full batten sail- high downhaul needed, huge pack size, etc etc.
I was pissing and moaning the whole time without ever having sailed one of these carts as it all was against my instincts.
I didn't really understand the sand yacht as mentioned above and thought it was all required to make them go.

Thankfully I had screwed up the full batten main when I re cut and that sail will not push at all.
Thankfully I had thrown a the old dacron sail in my gear as a light air option so I had a fall back and that ended up being a really good fit for the cart.
In future I think I would bring three of all the same type- but vary size/cloth weight for winds.

Though.... I can see the advantages of sail control with battens, sufficient downhaul etc
I am just for a start trying to flesh out a concept for build- different sails could be used with more complexity as needed..

Westward- I read your build thread with interest- that's a beautiful job you did on the build.
It looks like we are sitting at the same place- first builds and having a hoot discovering what these are about..

Thanks for your update, as your build thread disappeared for some reason.

Really great to see how it sailed and that your having a ball.

Thanks for sharing and good luck.

Thanks Chook2!

I assume you get the jist of why I asked to have that thread taken down.... pity- all those pretty pictures...LOL

So you can see I am going against the flow a bit here- seems the rest of sand yacht folks figured out that battens et al were a good thing 50 years ago...
I suppose I am taking from my cruising sailboat mentality where no fuss charms me...
Remarkable though just how well these craft make their way though-
On that run in the second video I was rolling along averaging ~50kph- fast!

One thing I noticed which perhaps you could comment on- there was very little apparent pressure on the sail- looking up I didn't see the strain so common when a heavy cruising boat under the press of a strong breeze.
Odd really- low sheet pressure and really moving out down the beach.
When I moved up to deep sand to stop the yacht I began to feel the real pressure of the wind.

I suppose the apparent wind had moved well forward and I was just getting a fine flow over the sail combined with the very low resistance of tires on this off wind course of travel.
If I came up just a tad the sail would go from loose to familiar pressure and the speed would jump up though anything nearing a broad reach carried me to the surf in short order..

Odd feeling though- never experienced in decades of mucking about in sailboats.
I never did try the fast cats or a foil boat- perhaps they see the same.

Hi Again

I wasn't having a go at you about the battens just wanted to understand your thinking.

Yes if your reaching down wind on the right angle you can find yourself traveling at 2 or 3 times true wind speed with the sail just holding its shape and very little wind noise. Harden up 5 degrees and the sail pressure increases and the apparent wind returns.

Sailing like that is such a joyful experience its easy to run a long way down wind, setting yourself up for a long sail home.

If you get the chance to sail on a dry lake instead of a beach you will see that the apparent wind has much more affect when your traveling at 2-3 times true wind. You will always be close hauled whatever point you sail other than straight down wind, this took me a bit of getting used to.

Sorry you might not know, Sylk & John HS are the both me, one's my work login

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Sylk said..
Hi Again

I wasn't having a go at you about the battens just wanted to understand your thinking.

Ah- no possible worries.

We all wear what banners we can for our accomplishments- given no others I enjoy my colorful endorsement of a Luddites view.
I have always been a bit of a primitive.
Give me enough time and I will try to convince you all that we should dispense with the whole contraption and sit on the beach with a beer enjoying the view.
Sand Yachting stripped down to its essence- contemplation unencumbered by a lowly vehicle..

Pity but here on the east coast of US dry lakes are few.
For the time being I will be limited to 'ribbon of sand' sailing and God forbid- Parking lots....
My shop is in Annapolis, MD which is stuffed to overflowing with sailing nuts- I understand there are some land sailors hidden in the masses here so will have to investigate to see where they sail and how active they are.
On the water I have never been in the racing crowd and was pursuing the sand yachting in the same manner- a vehicle for exploration.
I will see though- it seems like a hoot to race one of these..

Yeah this was a very particular feeling- very deep down wind course and yet traveling quite fast and the sail just about hanging loose.
Odd- hardly made sense..

Thanks trbnt,

You've given me a little more confidence in my first attempt at building a Lefroy Mini.

I had the brainwave yesterday when I noticed a couple of go-kart seats and an old surf-cat sail amongst the junk in the corner of the store. The sail must have been there for more than ten years and the seats at least five. I've been wondering what I could get the grand kids for Christmas and a land yacht sprang to mind.

I joined this forum yesterday and started my research. I did the planning last night while I should have been sleeping and then spent this afternoon searching the workshop and steel rack for bits and pieces. It seems I have a range of materials that will make the frame but with no sailing experience the overhead structure is going to be a challenge. However the kids or their parents have no experience either so they won't be expecting too much.

I've already started cutting and shaping material but I hoping to make it up to Rockingham tomorrow afternoon to see these things in the flesh.

I already have a workshop full of work but with Christmas just around the corner this has priority even if the wife see's it differently

Welcome 'Moneybox' to the forum, here is a link to the LLMini plans (very simple build and they work)... enjoy

www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Land-Yacht-Sailing/Construction/Build-a-Landyacht-Lake-Lefroy-Mini-Yacht/

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Gizmo said..
Welcome 'Moneybox' to the forum, here is a link to the LLMini plans (very simple build and they work)... enjoy

www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Land-Yacht-Sailing/Construction/Build-a-Landyacht-Lake-Lefroy-Mini-Yacht/

Thanks Gismo,

I printed each of the well drawn plans. I'll be following them as closely as my available materials will allow. We took the two hour drive to Rockingham this afternoon to see these machines working. Unfortunately we arrived too late and nearly everything was packed up.

However it was a great introduction to the club and their land yachts. Barry took the trouble to remove a little yacht that was packed away and set it up for us to have a go. What a blast.... I managed to end up half way across the lake on my side before the recovery vehicle arrived and Mrs M parked her's in the bush after losing control during a fit of panic. They are great bunch of guys eager to help a couple of newbies.

I got started on the frame yesterday but was flying blind. Seeing the finished article made what I should end up with a little clearer in my head. We took little diversion on the way back to Capel and arrived home with three sailboard masts and four sails. Now after studying the plans I cannot find the angle of the mast rake?

That's one of the rings that is asked on those plans... It is 10 deg but others have made them about 5 deg.